Maybe I Can with Debbie Weiss

Ep. 82: Thriving Amidst Adversity with Practical Tips and Resilience with Cathy VandenHeuvel

• Debbie Weiss

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This week on "The Maybe I Can" podcast, we’re joined by a remarkable guest who turned personal tragedy into a mission of empowerment for caregivers. Seven years ago, her life was turned upside down when both her father and husband were diagnosed with Stage 4 cancers within two weeks. Thrust into the demanding roles of caregiver while trying to maintain her corporate career and healthy lifestyle, she quickly discovered that balance is a myth.

She hit rock bottom, facing intense anxiety, stress, and overwhelm. There were days she didn’t want to get out of bed and moments when she resented her caregiving responsibilities. Through her journey, she learned invaluable lessons and developed strategies to not just survive, but thrive.

In this episode, she will share practical tips and heartfelt advice to help caregivers navigate their roles with resilience and grace. Discover how "Maybe I Can" moments can lead to a stronger, happier, and more fulfilled caregiving experience. Tune in for an inspiring conversation that promises to offer support and encouragement for all caregivers.

 Debbie Weiss:
http://www.debbierweiss.com
http://www.facebook.com/debbieseligmanweiss
http://www.instagram.com/debbie.r.weiss
http://www.linkedin.com/in/debbieweiss
http://www.tiktok.com/@debbierweiss
http://www.youtube.com/@debbierweiss

Cathy VandenHeuvel
 https://www.cathylvan.com/
 https://www.instagram.com/cathylynnvan
 https://www.facebook.com/cathylynnvan

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Speaker 1:

Hello and welcome to Maybe I Can, exploring possibilities one sprinkle at a time. If you've ever found yourself asking is this all there is to life, then you're in the right place. I'm Debbie author, speaker, entrepreneur and coach, and every Tuesday I'm here to share a sprinkle of hope and inspiration. Together, we'll uncover the more More joy, more fulfillment, more prosperity, more fun. We'll share stories of transformation, actionable tips and that little nudge you need to take the next step. So let's embark on this journey of discovery and say maybe I can to a life filled with more, ready to find out. Let's get started. The Maybe I Can Show starts now. Well, hi everyone and welcome back. Thank you for being here today. I got to tell you I didn't know if I was going to make it here today because about 36 hours ago I got hit with a stomach virus that kind of came out of nowhere. And if you're not watching on YouTube, good, because I ain't looking so pretty today. I couldn't do the makeup, I couldn't do any of it. I said none of that matters, the show must go on, right. So I'm very, very excited to welcome my guest today.

Speaker 1:

Her name is Kathy Vanden Heuvel and she is a remarkable woman that I actually met as a guest on her podcast called the Caregiver Cup Podcast. She has turned personal tragedy into a mission of empowerment for caregivers. Seven years ago, her life was turned upside down when both her father and husband were diagnosed with stage four cancers within two weeks of each other. Thrust into the demanding roles of caregiver while trying to maintain her corporate career and healthy lifestyle, she quickly discovered that balance is a myth. She hit rock bottom, facing intense anxiety, stress and overwhelm. There were days she didn't want to get out of bed and moments when she resented her caregiving responsibilities. Through her journey, she learned invaluable lessons and developed strategies to not just survive but thrive. And now, through her coaching and her podcast, she helps others learn to transform caregiving into a path of strength, joy and empowerment, by putting their well-being first. Kathy, welcome to the show.

Speaker 2:

Oh well, thank you, debbie. I feel like I'm talking to my friend again. It's so good that we're back together again and we get to go ahead and do that. Thank you for the opportunity to be on your podcast and congratulations for getting such a great podcast up and running and servicing your listeners. So thank you.

Speaker 1:

Thanks, I really appreciate that. And you know we had a connection right when we met and I think that, if the audience doesn't know, I've been a family caregiver for over 40 years and you know we just get each other right Because we've been there. We all the things that you know were listed in here the stress, the overwhelm, the resentment. You know, I think you know we all feel that sometimes we just don't want to admit it, right.

Speaker 2:

Right, and it's a constant thing. It's, it's ongoing and, you know, the introduction made it feel like I had it all figured out. I still don't have it figured out. There's good days and bad days. I describe it as an emotional roller coaster ride, when you're going up that roller coaster and down that roller coaster and then you go upside down and twirl around. I don't like roller coaster rides, by the way, but you know, but that's kind of the way it feels, yeah, oh absolutely, and isn't that life right?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, all right. So before we keep talking cause we're going to keep talking and it's going to go too fast I've got to ask you my signature question that I start every podcast with Tell us about a time when you went from a defeated I can't attitude to a more empowered. Maybe I can mindset.

Speaker 2:

You gave me this before this question. I had a time to prepare and you know this question is so good, debbie, because it made me go back and think about all of the challenge that I face, but I think the one that comes to my mind the most is about four years into my caregiving, when my husband's cancer journey just continues. It still is a seven-year battle and his cancer came back for like the fifth time. It was in remission it came back for the fifth time, but then science got better, research got better, and he was eligible for a stem cell transplant. And I was excited and there was tons of preparation to be done because we had to leave our home and go to the facility and stay there for six weeks, and so there was a lot of preparation, a lot of things that had to fall into place.

Speaker 2:

I was caregiving for my mom at that time after my dad had passed away, and I still had to leave for six weeks at least with him, and so I found myself, about three weeks into the, into the stem cell transplant. I was spent, I was done, I wanted to run away and I hit rock bottom, and not only everybody uses the words burnout and stress, which were definitely there, but I didn't want to be there anymore. I wanted to leave. I couldn't take it.

Speaker 2:

It felt like Groundhog's Day every single day and I think that tipping point until I got rid of the feel sorry for myself, kathy, and down in the dumps, kathy. I finally realized that and it's been like this all my whole journey is you have to. I had to hit rock bottom before I could go ahead and see that there are different ways. Maybe I can change this, maybe I can do something different. I don't have to follow the same I call them caregiving rules as everybody else else. And so during that journey, after three weeks, I shifted and I changed, and if you want me to, I can kind of describe what I was going through and then share some examples how I shifted, if you want me to.

Speaker 1:

No, absolutely. Yeah, that would be great. And I'm wondering and maybe this is part of what you're going to share yeah, how did you? What made you shift? You know, it's like when you're so down and you can't you can't see a way out. Was there some something you heard on TV Like? Was there a moment like that? Or just all of a sudden, something shifted in your head?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I think it was a combination of things. I think that when I get to this like I don't want to call it dark space, because it wasn't the dark mental health, suicide state If I want to be it was just a state where it was like I looked in the mirror at myself and said this is not who I am. I'm a lot stronger than this and I'm the kind of feisty woman that will say I'm going to win, I'm not going to let this beat me down. I think I looked at myself and I was eating sweets. I was not dressing nice again, I didn't care what everything was, but then I was just missing everything, and so what I did is I always had to, and I created my own framework, called the peace framework, where I had to pause and reflect on what was happening and really think about what I was feeling, what was going on, and then I had to embrace and validate the feelings, and once I did that, I was ready then to go ahead and change things. I had to shift things and let go of the guilt, the shame, the worrying about what people were going to say. One major shift that I made is because Dennis and I shared this one room Imagine a hotel room right, and we had to share this hotel room. Covid was still rapid, it was still going on in 2021. And so we had to go ahead.

Speaker 2:

The doctors made the decision. He was a healthy candidate to go ahead and re-harvest his bone marrow and put it back into him, but he had to avoid any type of disease, isolation, that sort of thing, and so he went to the facility for the day and then he would come home at night and I into the facility and I was his nurse. I was his nurse medication, you know, monitoring his, his, his blood pressure, his you know fevers and all that kind of stuff. I had to cook for him. He couldn't have anything raw so that we couldn't have any bacteria, and I had to keep that place as clean as I possibly could, wiping everything down.

Speaker 2:

I was just beating myself up trying to run 24 seven, in addition to trying to work from offsite, in addition to monitoring my mom, who was 200 miles away, to make sure that my brother was doing what he needed to do to care give my mom which I thought wasn't good enough In addition to my family taking care of the home and the dogs and all that kind of stuff. I had to say timeout. I'm putting a T up timeout. I have to change things. What can I control? What can I change?

Speaker 2:

And one of the things that I did is I went into the doc or the facility and said what if I drop? Now? Dennis is better now, these three last three weeks are monitoring what if I dropped him off and I went back? We were right across the street and I went back, we were right across the street. And what if I went back and I could clean the room, I could go ahead and do my work, I could work out, I could take a nap, because some nights I wasn't sleeping. And nobody did that. Everybody thought, even the nurses commented where's your wife today?

Speaker 1:

But I found that that was. I felt like a kid now in a candy store because I got time Exactly so before you were just going there and sitting with him.

Speaker 2:

Yes, and he was really what he was doing. He was just sitting there, he had to go, he had to get labs, he had to see the doctor, then they had to give him IV therapy platelets, whatever it would be Right, and he would sleep most of the time or watch his, his movie on his iPad. And I was just sitting there.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so smart yes.

Speaker 2:

But it's kind of going against the grain and I was thinking, what if I could do this and I would get the? I would get his lab results on my phone app, because I had an app to communicate. I could read his notes If I wanted to. I could go in one morning and talk to the doctor and leave. I didn't have to be there 24 seven and he was actually relieved because we were driving each other crazy after three weeks being together in one room. You know that kind of thing, yeah, and so those were just some of the things that I had to change. That that was one of them. I wasn't taking care of myself either, so I that, once I started finding a way and a routine, it started becoming manageable.

Speaker 1:

And well, first of all, let me ask you how is he doing today?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, he, is doing okay. I mean, he is still. He's still getting immune therapy. Now, again, the treatments have gotten better. It'll be a be just a lifetime fight. Yeah, if we can keep it under control, we'll be fine. You know that sort of thing. This is the first time, deb, in my life, in my caregiving life, that I don't have to care. I'm not caring for two people now. Yeah, so it feels like a little bit of a treat.

Speaker 1:

So, yeah, did you see the balloons come up? Yeah, I love that. The balloons, the balloons popped up. That is a reason to celebrate, for sure. So I think you know what I I agree wholeheartedly with is that you started making yourself a priority. You advocated for what you needed, and as a caregiver, it does feel selfish, like I am not supposed to be putting myself first. Look at my husband, look what he's going through. Or my father, or my mother, whoever it is you're caring for, caring for, and if I try and prioritize my own self-care, then I'm not a good caregiver, I'm. I'm selfish, I'm, you know. And so talk about that, because I think that's a very common thing feeling, don't you?

Speaker 2:

I know it and I'm on this mission to change this, this word, these words out here. From a caregiving perspective, it care has to be you first and and we have to change the cultural mindset the cultural I don't know what it's called out there to say that when you're a caregiver, you give up everything. I mean, you were one of my inspirations when I interviewed you on this. You wrote your book during caregiving, Yep, and I coach caregivers to say what are you doing each and every day for yourself? What purpose do you have each and every day? To get out of bed, because I think that's it. I started my podcast during the pandemic and right in the midst of my caregiving journey, and so you have to find that way. And, like I said, balance is just a myth when it comes to caregiving. You just have to find a way to go ahead and saying, okay, 50-50, or you have to commit to 30-70. What is going to be your commitment, and not everything's going to stick for you. You may have been a runner before you ran. You know you ran and you ran marathons, or you went to the gym or you attended, you sang in the choir before you became a caregiver. Well, now things might be a little bit different and you may have to go ahead and do things different.

Speaker 2:

When I was in the stem cell transplant, after those first three weeks I said what can I do? I'm sitting all day. I have time on weekends, especially when I didn't have to go ahead and work from that facility. I taught myself how to knit, of all things I taught myself, I Googled it and I said well, I have to do something to go ahead and keep my mind occupied. I took some self-development courses as well, just to be able to go ahead and keep my mind busy. And I think that's the big thing. I have many clients too, that I have one client that finally, she went ahead and hired somebody for an hour a week and she goes and is learning how to play the cello, just so that she has something that she can go ahead and do to take care of herself. And it doesn't have to be physical, it can be mindfulness practices, it could be a hobby. It's something outside of you know, the caregiving world. It's not that you don't love your husband, you love yourself too.

Speaker 1:

Exactly, and you show up as a better caregiver, because you're in a better place and you're no longer, as you know, feeling those strong feelings of resentment and overwhelm and anxiety and all of that stuff. And it's so funny that you mentioned all of these things learning something new and for me writing was new and it's so funny because you just wouldn't think, oh, at a time like this, now you think is a good time to learn something new, but it's amazing because it really does take you out of the situation, right, especially, I think, when you're learning something new, one. It's novel, right, it's exciting, but the brainpower that you just you can't even think about what else is going on because you have to devote everything to. You know, watching the video to learn how to knit, or you know with the cello lesson or whatever it is. And and it's kind of counterintuitive, I think people think what you decided this is a good time to take up knitting. Well, why not?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and it's. It's amazing because when I was there at, it was called Kathy's house not my name, but Kathy's house with a K across the street from the facility that I was at in Milwaukee, wisconsin, there were people. I was watching other caregivers and I was having conversations with other caregivers. I am not a good cook at all and I totally admit it but there were people that were baking and they were trying new recipes. There was one lady that bought this oh, it's not a crock pot, but it's the I don't know the fast crock pot thing she was experimenting and trying new meals and she was feeding the whole facility, experimenting and trying new meals. And she was feeding the whole facility and there were people that were in the corner painting and there were caregivers that were finding different things to do.

Speaker 2:

And eventually we became this little network of people where, when I would drop Dennis off, I could go ahead and see if there was a group down there having coffee. I could sit and have coffee with them and we could talk about what's happening. But we also could talk about what are you reading today? What are you doing today? And we were able to go ahead and help each other out or inspire each other to do something different and not get stuck into that negative space where our brain wants us to go the whole time.

Speaker 1:

I love that. It's like you created your own little support network right there, right in the cafeteria, and they knew there's nothing better.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and they knew I hated to cook because I'm the messiest cook, and so there would always be somebody like Kathy, do you need a little help there? Because there was, there was kitchens. It was really nice. There were kitchens there, there were, there were stations in there. It was a big, big room with six little L-shaped kitchens with cupboards and stoves and refrigerators, and so it was nice because we you would have either go grocery shopping I had to go really early in the morning with a mask on and so I wouldn't bring anything back but then you could cook there. They had crockpots and stoves and ovens and all of that stuff, so that I would have to go ahead and carry a tray back to the room for Dennis so that he could eat in the room. But it was so convenient so you wouldn't have to worry about catching anything. That's wonderful.

Speaker 1:

They thought of everything now and you were saying you were still working. So at what point did you continue to work? How did you find that? What was your employer saying? You know, were they understanding? I mean, that's tough.

Speaker 2:

That was a big challenge, debbie, but at least I had. I knew that in November, that he was going to get a stem cell transplant in January, so I could have the discussion with my team and my boss, because I was working for a Fortune 100 company managing 30 some people through facilitators, and so I had to figure out am I going to continue to work, or am I going to continue, or am I going to go on disability? So I worked with my boss a lot and I was able to divide up a lot of my responsibilities and kind of be more of like a project manager versus really deep in the weeds. Part of me still feels like I should have taken disability the first few weeks, but I didn't know what. I didn't know because I worked when I could and I would make up my time on the weekends, so I was just burning the candle at both ends. By three weeks I was done because I was trying to do too much, but eventually it got easier because I found time for that.

Speaker 2:

But if I had to give advice to anybody the first couple of weeks, feel it out. Don't overload your plate with the, because when you have something to do, it's always in the back of your mind. And so you're at, I'm helping Dennis through his, all of his procedures. In the back of my mind I'm like, well, I got to get back, I got to get this in. I can't keep the lights on late at night because he's got to sleep. When am I going to be, you know? So my head was just racing with that.

Speaker 2:

But good, I guess my advice would be good conversations with your boss, good conversations with your loved one, and being realistic about it and going ahead and doing that. I, I, I pat myself on the back that I went ahead and said I will try and I will work as much as I can. But on the flip side, I know my mentality, I'm it, I. Maybe it's our generation, debbie, where we just know we're going to get it done and we have to be this good little employee to do it. So that's kind of one of my things.

Speaker 1:

Do you, and luckily let me just say that luckily it's now more. It's becoming caregiving and family caregiving is something, a topic topic that is becoming is gaining notoriety, right, and employers are realizing this is just a part of what we need to do and how are we going to support our caregivers, our family caregivers. So I'm glad that it's finally something that is being talked about and hopefully embraced.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I use the word a lot experiment. Yeah, have to keep experimenting as a caregiver, because not everybody's path is different and not one size fits all, so you just have to keep saying, well, I love your theme, maybe I can do this, maybe I can try this, maybe this will work, and that's what you do and keep going.

Speaker 1:

So let me ask you how would you say that your caregiving journey has changed you as a person?

Speaker 2:

My gosh. It has taught me so much about problem problem solving, about emotional intelligence, about listening to my inner voice and my inner mind. It just has taught me that and taught me self-compassion. So I think caregiving is a self-growth journey. It has. I mean you know that from you you learn so much about yourself. I mean you have to Communication skills, anger management, problem solving. I mean it's a constant thing and if you don't go ahead and look at your self-growth and development, you're just going to be one of the feeling of stuck caregivers that's in the negative space all the time. I think it takes a special type of person to go ahead and say I need help and I want to go ahead and improve myself and that's the people that I want to help. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1:

So with that because I knew our 30 minutes would fly by we didn't even scratch the surface, so hopefully you'll come back at a later date so we can continue talking about this. But please tell people where can they learn about you and your podcast and all the things.

Speaker 2:

I think the biggest thing is come and go on and onto your favorite podcast app and go to the caregiver cup. I've been out there now for three plus. It'll be four years in October, so that's that's where I share my voice and you will have an opportunity to text me off of that. You can see my website off of those show notes. Now, if you don't have the podcast app or you don't want to listen to a podcast, which I don't think your listeners will, you can go out to my website at kathylvancom.

Speaker 1:

And, of course, we'll have that in the show notes. Kathy, thank you so much. I really appreciate you taking the time to come on and share all of your caregiver wisdom with me myself and the audience.

Speaker 2:

It is my pleasure, thank you.

Speaker 1:

Thanks for spending part of your day with me here on Maybe I Can, exploring possibilities, one sprinkle at a time. It's been great having you and I hope you're leaving with a spark to light up your journey to more. Remember, every big change starts with a single maybe. If you're ready to kickstart that change but not sure where to begin, I've got just the thing for you. Head over to download my free guide, the One Critical Step to Kickstart Change, and take that all-important first step. Let's make those maybes into reality, one sprinkle at a time. Catch you next Tuesday at 4 pm Eastern, 1 pm Pacific, with more stories, tips and that extra push you might need. I'm Debbie saying goodbye for now, but always remember maybe, just maybe, you can.

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Debbie Weiss

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