Maybe I Can with Debbie Weiss

Ep. 110: Healing Through Forgiveness with Katharine Giovanni

• Debbie Weiss

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In this episode of Maybe I Can, I’ll be joined by Katharine Giovanni, a three-time award-winning best-selling author, speaker, and pioneer in the independent concierge industry. Katharine has written over twelve books, including her latest, The Ultimate Path to Forgiveness: Unlocking Your Power.

Her inspiring journey—from overcoming stage 3 breast cancer to finding resilience through a challenging childhood—has shaped her unique perspective on forgiveness. We’ll discuss the transformative power of forgiveness, how it can unlock your inner strength, and Katharine’s insights into forgiving even the unforgivable. Whether you’ve struggled with letting go or wondered if forgiveness is possible without confronting someone face-to-face, this episode is packed with practical wisdom and empowerment.

Don’t miss this heartfelt and enlightening conversation!

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Speaker 1:

Hello and welcome to Maybe I Can, exploring possibilities one sprinkle at a time. If you've ever found yourself asking is this all there is to life, then you're in the right place. I'm Debbie author, speaker, entrepreneur and coach, and every Tuesday I'm here to share a sprinkle of hope and inspiration. Together, we'll uncover the more More joy, more fulfillment, more prosperity, more fun. We'll share stories of transformation, actionable tips and that little nudge you need to take the next step. So let's embark on this journey of discovery and say maybe I can to a life filled with more, ready to find out. Let's get started. The Maybe I Can Show starts now.

Speaker 1:

Hi everyone, and welcome to the Maybe I Can Podcast. I'm your host, debbie Weiss, and happy 2025. Thanks for kicking off the new year with me. You know I have to be honest. Until I looked in the camera, I forgot that I was not in my show outfit. I was in my all day working outfit and this is what happens when you don't look at yourself. But you know I have to show you if you can see on camera. I've got that L-O-V-E you know the love old kind of logo. But anyhow, today I'm very excited about the perfect guest to inspire us and a great way to kick off the new year with talking about forgiveness.

Speaker 1:

So meet my guest, catherine Giovanni. She's a three-time award-winning best-selling author, speaker and one of the original founders of the independent concierge industry. Catherine has authored over 12 books, including her latest release, the Ultimate Path to Forgiveness Unlocking your Power. Catherine's journey from battling stage three breast cancer to navigating a challenging childhood has given her profound insights about resilience and forgiveness. Join us as Catherine shares these invaluable lessons and explores the transformative power of forgiveness. Get ready for a conversation that is brimming with inspiration and empowerment. Catherine, welcome to the show. Thanks so much for having me. I appreciate it Absolutely. To the show. Thanks so much for having me. I appreciate it Absolutely. So I'm going to ask you the same question that I ask all my guests, and from your introduction, I'm sure you have many answers that you can choose from, but tell us about a time where you went from a defeated I can't mindset to an empowered maybe I can attitude.

Speaker 2:

I have all sorts of stories I could tell you, breast cancer being probably one of the ones leading the pack the time I tried to commit suicide in the eighth grade. My life is filled with scenarios of maybe I can. I'm not sure I can, but maybe I can. I'm like the little engine that could. You know, I think I can, I think I can. Oh yeah, and in the eighth grade I tried to commit suicide because my parents were very pickled, meaning they were both alcoholics. So I come from a rough background. Connect all the dots you want, they're probably all right. I was really bullied in school because I was different. So I tried to commit suicide and I turned into one of those teenagers. You know who I'm talking about One friend draped in black, of course.

Speaker 2:

I lived in Manhattan at the time and we all wore black. So I'm not sure how much that counts. That counts, but I spent the next 10, 15 years just kind of drifting and then my mother fell down a flight of stairs, broke her hip and ended up in the hospital. And even my mother couldn't get a gin and tonic in the hospital. So she dried out and went to rehab and we became closest sisters I mean as close as sisters closer, and we did that for three years and then she died sisters closer and we did that for three years and then she died and I realized that if I didn't change my life I was going to die. So I have been I.

Speaker 2:

It was January 1 of 1990, I made a New Year's resolution to never drink again, and it's been 35 years since that day. So I quit drinking and that kind of launched me into. Maybe there's something out there for me. You know, I got, I've been married for 33 years and I've written a bunch of books. But you know it's forgiveness is really the fuel, that that fired that engine. Throughout the whole thing. And the thing about forgiveness, it's a funny thing. Throughout the whole thing. And the thing about forgiveness, it's a funny thing. Everybody tells you to forgive. Nobody teaches you how and what if you don't want to? What if it's an unforgivable act? Then what do you do? So I'm the one, I'm a forgiveness coach and I teach people how.

Speaker 1:

So amazing, very interesting story? I want to know. Amazing, very interesting story. I want to know. Did I want to know so many things before I even start talking about forgiveness? And I know that that's what we're going to get into. But from that time, when were you always the kind of person that was able to bounce back? You know, you obviously things got to such a low point in eighth grade that you tried to take your own life, but then did you just say oh okay, I'm good now, I mean, you know, you said it took 10 or 15 years.

Speaker 2:

you're trying to find yourself like.

Speaker 1:

Do you think that being resilient or having that strength came from all your adversity or people born with it? You know how are you dealing in between all of those things. It doesn't kill you it makes you stronger, right yeah. I have always been.

Speaker 2:

I've always been a positive person and I've always had some way to, as Taylor Swift says, shake it off, and I've always had at least one. Even back then I had one or two really close friends that I turned to in times of trial. One of them talked me out of committing suicide. And I've always been a writer. It's my happy place. I love to write. So I dove into books like Laura Ingalls Wilder Little House on the Prairie Don't laugh, don't judge, I'm not joking, I'm only kidding. I'm only kidding. She had the ideal family that I loved. I read Little Women. Books were always my oasis and I always had my eye on somebody that could leave me out of the dark and I always had this thought in my head that I was meant for bigger things than what I was doing. So that kind of led the way. It was like a carrot.

Speaker 1:

So interesting. You hear a lot, of, a lot of celebrities that overcame adversity, that say that they always felt that they were meant for more and it's, it's. I guess that just inner knowing right it's. Is that how you would describe?

Speaker 2:

it. Well, I've also not to stretch anybody's brain to the point of pain, but I am really really, really intuitive and I learned very young that I could hear that little bird in your shoulder and I could talk to it. I'm clairaudient, which for anybody who doesn't know means I'm clear hearing meaning I anybody who doesn't know means I'm clear. Hearing meaning I can I hear words in my head from the other side, and I've known how to do that since I was a kid. So it's like I had this best friend that I could always talk to and always turn to and always ask questions.

Speaker 1:

Which is amazing. I did see that that was one of your books when I was doing a little research before I met you, and that really did intrigue me. I mean, it's another thing, though. Is that a gift that you're? Obviously it's a gift that you're born with, but one that we all have. Some of us have to cultivate it more than others. Is that what you would say?

Speaker 2:

Everybody on the planet is psychic. I don't like the word psychic. I never use the word psychic because it has this connotation that I'm a used car salesman with a crystal ball and I'm going to take your money. That's actually as far from the truth as you can get. Everybody is psychic. Everybody hears, sees, knows or just feels something.

Speaker 2:

You walk into a room and it just it feels off. You can't pin it, but it just feels wrong. Or you look at somebody's resume looks great. You talk to them, they're perfect. But in your head you're thinking I probably shouldn't hire this person. But you do because your brain talks you out of it.

Speaker 2:

But in your heart that little bird in your shoulder is kind of tripping at you saying you shouldn't do it. And sure enough, six months down the line everything blows up and you look at somebody and say I knew I shouldn't have done that. That is what everybody has it. Sometimes you hear the little bird in my shoulder saved my life three times. Not that I'm counting particularly, but three times. Not that I'm counting particularly, but it has saved my life. It saves other people's lives. You know you can avoid a car crash. There's hundreds of thousands of stories out there, but you know it's. You either see it, feel it, know it, or you just, or you just sense it, and everybody has those gifts. I am nobody special. I just came into this lifetime already knowing how to do it, but everybody can do it and everybody can learn. You're doing it now. Yeah, I wouldn't be on your show if you weren't.

Speaker 1:

It's true, I do agree with that and I do happen to say that I agree, I lost my husband two years ago and on December 31, it was my son's birthday, my husband passed away. It was two years, on December 30th. I'm sorry, thank you. And we're sitting playing a game and I said to my son and his girlfriend I said, you know, because I don't think that there's such big believers. And I said I know that you're going to maybe think this is strange, but I just know that dad is here and he's here to say happy birthday. Okay, because I felt him and I also seemed to get a scent of stale cigarettes, if you have to know what it is, which is disgusting, but he used to smoke.

Speaker 2:

A lot of people. A friend of mine smells a pipe. That was her grandfather, your husband. I'm going to freak everybody out who's watching this. I know I am, but he's standing right behind you. I am clairaudient, clairsentient, I'm actually all of them and I'm very intuitive, and he's standing right behind you. I am clear audience, clear ascension. I'm actually all of them and I'm very intuitive, and he's standing right behind you.

Speaker 2:

Be that as it may, everybody can do this. My husband was, a month ago, was in a horrible car accident. He's going to be fine, but he's been in the hospital for a month and the day he'd happened I just had this sixth sense that something was wrong. I knew something was wrong, I knew something was going to happen and it did. Everybody can do this, and one of the books I wrote teaches you how to do this. But it's really the guiding force behind how I managed to bounce back from all these, all these things. It looks it almost. I almost feel like I'm God's guinea pig and I go through these horrible things and then I write about them and I put them in a book. So the other day I actually looked up at the ceiling. I said could you dial back the severity a little bit. It's okay, can I have a vacation from it, but yeah.

Speaker 1:

So you know you were supposed to be a guest on this show the day he had the car accident.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I was, yeah, I was.

Speaker 1:

And I remember you said he broke his arm but he's going to be OK.

Speaker 2:

His arm broke. His back broke four ribs. He's been in the hospital for like four weeks. I had to cancel so many podcasts. The good news is he's. He's to be fine and he's going to recover. It's just going to take a minute.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, well, good, very, very glad to hear that. All right, so let's move on to forgiveness and this unusual formula that you have, that you can teach us how to forgive the unforgivable.

Speaker 2:

Well, first of all, just because I forgive you doesn't mean I want a relationship with you. Probably don't. Forgiveness does not necessarily mean repair. Just because I forgive you doesn't mean I'm giving you a pass. It doesn't mean that all of a sudden you're right. I think that stems from our childhood. When we're as kids, we're saying no, go, say you're sorry and then go off and play with each other. That's actually not right. I'm not giving you a pass, you're still wrong. You're still a dumpster fire.

Speaker 2:

What forgiveness means is I want you out of my head, bottom line. I want to stop thinking about you. I want to stop dreaming about you. I want you out of my head so I can start to live life again. And the other person is probably not even thinking about you at all.

Speaker 2:

So, on a scale of on a 10 scale, with 10 being unforgivable and one being the easiest person to forgive everybody watching this right now, y'all are thinking of your number 10, that unforgivable person, and that's fair. But you don't have to forgive the unforgivable unforgivable person, and that's fair, but you don't have to forgive the unforgivable. Why? Because there's many people, places and things and I did say places and things stay with me that you can forgive before you even get to that person. How about the person on I-95 South that cuts you off? Forgive that person. How about the person that cuts you off in the grocery store? Forgive that person. Start with the easy ones and work your way up to the hard ones. That's part of the system. It's a step-by-step system that's going to slowly get you to be able to forgive the unforgivable. Now, why have I said you don't have to forgive the unforgivable? Because, in my humble opinion, for what it's worth, I truly believe there are things that are unforgivable out there and I truly believe there are unforgivable people out there, and I also believe that everybody's measure of that is different. What I think is unforgivable, you may think isn't, so that's fair. If you have an unforgivable person that you just literally can't forgive, that's fine. I want you to pick apart the memory. So I'm going to have you sit down and write a list of all the people you want to forgive, and from the sandbox to present day, and then I want you to rate them from one to 10. 10 being awful, one being easy, and you can have 20 number fours if you want I don't care and you can also skip numbers. If you want, just write the list.

Speaker 2:

And then my mantra is very simple. It's a very simple, real quick poem. You don't have to dance unless you like to dance. You don't have to burn incense or carry crystals, unless that's what you like to do. It's a very simple thing.

Speaker 2:

And then the secret sauce to the whole thing is energy. I get a lot of people looking at me and say I did forgive them, you did, you did the work, you stumbled on the correct formula and you were able to forgive. But they're not staying forgiven. Why? Because you didn't forgive the energy around them. Einstein did prove correctly that energy is neither created nor destroyed. It just transforms from one thing to another. He also said that everything, including this little microphone, has an energy around it. So my system you forgive. I completely forgive Debbie. I completely forgive the energy around Debbie. I completely forgive myself, the energy around myself, I completely forgive the energy around the whole thing. That's the pump, real simple.

Speaker 2:

And then I want you to check in with your body. Are you still angry? If you are okay? Are they still a seven? Or did you get down to a six? Or was it a four and now you're up to a seven. Why are you up to a seven? Because the mind is a brilliant tool and it protects you. And that first round got rid of the first layer of the onion many layers to an onion and it looked, it said, oh okay, debbie's ready, so it's going to unlock that back closet, unlock the padlock, and memories are going to pour out of you that you don't remember. Write them down, keep going. My method is a marathon, it is not a sprint, and I only want you to do really five to 10 at a time. And I have a reason behind doing that, because I don't want you to make yourself sick, but do it before bed, because your body heals itself.

Speaker 2:

When it comes to the unforgivable you might be, the you might yourself, maybe yourself, maybe you're your unforgivable person. It's entirely possible. Pick apart the memory. In other words, let's take one of my childhood bullies. Let's say I wanted to forgive my bully, which I did, and I didn't want to forgive the bully. Pick apart the memory. Forgive the table, the chair, the building, the playground, the people that stood around and didn't help you. That's what you forgive. Forgive your childhood home, forgive your workplace, forgive your desk, everything and the energy around these things and that's going to start freeing up your mind. I forgave 1974. I'm dating myself now. That's the year I tried to commit suicide. I forgave cancer. I forgave the chemo. I forgave the chemo chair for radiation. I forgave that radiation slab and it really is a slab. It's awful, you know. I forgave all of that and it freed my mind up. You can forgive anything. If it's making you angry, you can forgive it.

Speaker 1:

And I think the most important part to kind of get you rolling is to realize something that you said in the beginning, which was that other person is most likely not thinking about you. No, they're not. It's all you. It's all you. It's all. You're causing more harm and strife to yourself. Yeah, your anger and your is not productive in any way.

Speaker 2:

It's like drinking poison and hoping the other person dies. Right, I mean it's, and they're living inside your head. So, because they're living inside your head, may I dare say that you can forgive dead people, because it doesn't matter where they are or where they're not, it doesn't matter, they're alive and well inside your mind. Now let's talk about the forgive and forget garbage. Nobody's going to forget. I'm from New York. We don't forget anything. Neither do you in Jersey. We're not going to forget people. Okay, there might be some unicorn person on the planet that can forget. I'm not your girl, not going to happen.

Speaker 2:

But if you use my method, what I can promise is neutrality. My method will remove the emotional charge. So when you go on Facebook or you go to a party, you see this person's name or you see the person themselves. You won't care. You won't care. Your brain's not going to want to smash them. You're not going to go back into the memory. You literally won't care. You're not going to think good things or bad things. It'll be neutral. You won't care. And that's what I'm looking for. I'm looking for neutrality so you can concentrate and get your life back.

Speaker 1:

So there's no reason for you to. Let's say the person is alive. Let's say that you do run into them at a party and it's an uncomfortable situation and you have no interest in talking to them, even though you forgave them. What do you do? I would imagine that I'm thinking of a particular situation, of course, in my own life, and I have forgiven them. My friends and family don't understand why I've forgiven them and maybe I've made excuses for them in my mind. I don't know the whole story because we've never gotten far enough together to discuss it. She's mad, I'm mad, you know, and it's a he said, she said, and no one knows what's going on inside the other person's head. Is there a time where it pays to talk it through with the other person?

Speaker 2:

You can talk it through. If you want closure, you don't have to. Forgiveness is selfish. You do it for you. You don't have to reach out to the other person. You can do it in the privacy of your own home. Nobody has to know you're doing it. And that actually happened to me.

Speaker 2:

Once I did run into a person that I had forgiven and it was you know, it was an event, and I saw them and you know I didn't care. And what did we talk about? What, what? What strangers talk about? We talked about the weather. I wish them well. Did I really mean that I wished them well, you know, in some universe? Yeah, I really did wish them well. I don't wish ill on anybody, but I wasn't angry. I carried on a conversation. It was a short conversation and that was that. There was no emotional charge. When I saw that person I had no desire to walk up to them, sure, but when they walk up to me, shook their hand how are you? Didn't say it was nice to see you, because there was some part of me that kind of you know didn't think it was nice, particularly.

Speaker 1:

But it wasn't not nice.

Speaker 2:

I didn't care. It's like so you know what are you up to. It was a very vanilla conversation, bland, and that's what you're going for, and I left. Not, I wasn't angry. It didn't take me a week to pull me off the ceiling, I just went about my life. I was neutral about it.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, what about? Like you talked about your bully. You know, when I wrote my memoir and I started telling certain stories, boy, I didn't realize how much anger I still even had inside of me from what happened when I was five years old, eight years old. All the stories, and just reliving that through writing, you know, it brought this whole well of emotion forward. Now let's say, yeah, I mean, and I wasn't anticipating that, even though they say it I thought, oh yeah, because writing has never I'm not until more recently I haven't had that connection to writing, so I was unaware the benefit of what it can do. But what about the person who hasn't written or doesn't journal? How do we know? Are we still angry? Have we not forgiven? You know, does it pay to do an exercise in looking back and trying to figure out who we might still be holding a grudge against?

Speaker 2:

That's where the little burn in your shoulder is going to come into play. There's all sorts of worksheets and stuff in the book, blah, blah, blah. But I want you to sit down and just write a list, and the list you write today is going to be different than the list you're going to write next week. And I want you, without thinking about it, write down 10 people that you think you need to forgive First 10. Don't judge yourself, don't second guess it. Write it down. And if you write down something like a little red wagon, which my best friend did, she didn't know why she wrote down a little red wagon, had no memory of a little red wagon, yet there it was in her paper. She didn't judge it, she just forgave it. Simple thing. Obviously it was a level one kind of forgiveness thing, but she tossed it. Don't judge, just write the first 10. Then label the people one through 10. An eight, a nine or 10 person will be on that list, because that's what you're thinking of right now. Don't judge that either. Just put them on the list and then we'd start with the number one and work your way up. When you're done with that list, start it again.

Speaker 2:

Now, if you manage to forgive somebody, scratch their name off. If you do the forgiveness mantra and you're still mad, okay, well, maybe the 10 is down to a nine, maybe there's still a 10. Okay, wait 24 hours, do it again. Maybe you can't forgive your number 10 at all. Okay, just forgive the energy and nothing else. Okay, catherine, I don't need to forgive anybody. I'm good. There's nobody in my life I have to forgive. Okay, sure, let's talk about that.

Speaker 2:

Did you get mad at the news the other night? Forgive the news. Forgive the politicians. Did your football player, football team lose? Forgive the team. Or say this for the next 10 days or the next week. I completely forgive myself for not being able to forgive and the energy around this thought. Say that every day for the next week and I'm pretty sure that when you sit down to finally write a list of people, but that that back closet of your mind is gonna open up and you're gonna finally think about some names. We're humans. Humans irritate other humans. Somebody cuts you off in aisle five of the grocery store yesterday. Put that person on your list. Your mail was late. Somebody didn't show up for a podcast. Put these people on your list.

Speaker 1:

And what about forgiving yourself? Does forgiving yourself? You know? I know so many people who live with regrets. Why didn't I? Why you know those, know so many people who live with regrets, why didn't I? Why you know those kinds of things I mean. To me those seem like you've got to let yourself off the hook and move on.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, this is the first book of three, and the second book is about how to forgive yourself, and I'm writing it right now. But to forgive yourself, I want you to treat yourself like a number 10. And this is how I did it.

Speaker 2:

I compartmentalized myself Because when I woke up this morning, all my past selves are in the past. I can't do anything about them. I'm a new person every morning. So I took teenage Catherine and I looked at her. I looked at the things that I did. I wrote down those memories, I wrote down the people I thought I hurt and I forgave myself for all of those things using my own mantra. And I rated them. Some of them were a 10, some of them were a one. And when I through that decade and I managed it, I went to the next decade and I did it again, and I did that in combination with my own personal number 10s. You know who, who I wanted to forgive.

Speaker 1:

But when it came to myself.

Speaker 2:

I just substituted everything and I forgave things memory by memory, and I can't tell you how freeing it was.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, I think all of us, at some point or another, have forgiven, and it is freeing, and it's us that we're letting free. So, catherine, I can't believe a half hour has already gone by. You've given us such fabulous information and I want everyone to be able to get a copy of your book and see the worksheets and all the work that you do. So where can the audience learn more about you?

Speaker 2:

well, you could easily go to amazon. The book is on amazon and I do understand that not everybody likes to read, so the audiobook, the ebook and the paperback are available. You can go to my website at katherinegiovannicom, and k thanks to my mother is spelled a little strangely. Thanks, mom. K-a-t-h-a-r-i-n-e. Giovannicom and all my socials are on there.

Speaker 1:

Everything's on CatherineGiovannicom and the links are in our show notes so you can check it out there. Catherine, thank you so much and best wishes to your husband. Thank you so much and best wishes to your husband, thank you, and thank you for sharing all of your wisdom with us. Thank you To everyone else. I will see you next week. Make it a great one.

Speaker 1:

Thanks for spending part of your day with me here on Maybe I Can, exploring possibilities one sprinkle at a time. It's been great having you and I hope you're leaving with a spark to light up your journey to more. Remember, every big change starts with a single Maybe. If you're ready to kickstart that change but not sure where to begin, I've got just the thing for you. Head over to download my free guide the one critical step to Kickstart Change and take that all-important first step. Let's make those maybes into reality, one sprinkle at a time. Catch you next Tuesday at 4 pm Eastern, 1 pm Pacific, with more stories, tips and that extra push you might need. I'm Debbie saying goodbye for now, but always remember maybe, just maybe, you can.

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